Copper, update

The usual then – Oct 2012 – and now charts;

copper s oct 2012copper 2013

EW worked perfectly in predicting an e wave in the triangle and then a thrust down to just under $3 a pound. However our expectation was ultimately for a steeper drop, more towards $2 or less. Maybe even a lot less. In our original count we were looking for an A-B-C type of correction given that the size of the triangle was too large for anything but a B-wave. Now again history seems to be repeating itself as there seems to be another triangle in the making, which would then make the count more of an A-B-C X A-B-C. Whether correct or not, the upshot is that copper is going lower. Easier to see from the big picture;

copper dec 21 b 2013

Never mind the count, this stuff is still too expensive.

Copper, the stuff update and FCX, Freeport

copper s oct 2012copper dec 2012

The then (29th of Oct.) and now charts. This is a bona fide triangle, an E-Waver’s dream as these things are highly predictive and accurate. This triangle is in a B-wave position, not a fourth, therefore the expectation is for a C-leg to start any moment now and travel, perhaps, the same distance as the A-leg. That would bring copper to about $2.20 a pound and , yes, we are aware that the Chinese will do more to stimulate but for the moment their Shanghai index recorded a 3 year low. Stocks like FCX, Freeport will not fare well under such circumstances.

Here are the Freeport McMoran Copper and Gold then (Jan) and now charts for a comparison;

fcx s jan 2012FCX dec 2012

We recommended a sell at the time (at $45) even if it might go a little higher. At today’s level of , give or take $31 that is a tidy saving. The company decided to go into the oil business presumable to diversify. Presently it may be tracing out a similar triangle to the metal itself, even if it is running behind just a bit. The e–leg is missing but these can be awfully short so it wont take much to get the two realigned. Sell all copper related stocks, except perhaps Ivanhoe, TRQ see next..

Copper.

copper b oct 2012copper m oct 2012

Somewhere in 2002 copper probable started a new bull leg, pretty much the way gold did from 2001. The exact wave count from there is not perfectly clear but the best fit would be 5 up into the highs of 2008 followed by an A for the great recession drop and then a B (to moderately higher highs) in the rebound. This is , of course, an industrial commodity used just about every where. Demand from China is reportedly a significant factor, particularly when it is stockpiled over and above the immediate needs. Should this demand weaken further the price, which like all commodities , is determined in the margin, could drop quite a bit further. Note that even with the recent drop we are still something like 3x the price for the first 15 years of the chart. In detail things look like this;

copper s oct 2012

For the past year the price has triangulated as the world is debating the hard or soft landing question for China. We have no answer to that but simple observe that the pattern, so far at least, is that of a triangle. As stated so many times before these occur only in wave 4 or B positions. Given the apparent overlap with wave 2 (which might not be the case) we would prefer the wave B alternative but for the immediate future it does not matter. If the triangle continues it should form an e wave next and then drop to , at least 2.75 which, by the way, is the level of the b in the B, a normal point. Should all this transpire you do not want to stay in copper stocks but for the moment there is no rush. FCX, Freeport,BHP and many others have very similar charts.  Below is a chart that could support a 5 wave count;

copper oct 2012 lme